Survival Of The Fittest

im the dependable and trustworthy dmboogie, much like my good friend and fakeclaim speedwagon

Zetsu wrote: ↑Sat Apr 11, 2020 9:10 pm Inclined to townread Slam if Cactus turns out to be scum. Scumread him if he's town/third party.

I'm down to revisit this next day, but while it's too early to tell, I feel kind of the opposite. I think it'd be a good play to go hard on me (especially considering the lack of substantial reasoning behind it?) if he's trying to change everyone's course from Cactus back to me. I got the sense Slam's posts could be interpreted as (though it's not super apparent) a defense of Dodd to try and prevent him from getting lynched. He also changed course to vote for Dodd as soon as it was made clear to him that Dodd wasn't coming back and that it's better to just take him out of play than to let him be replaced by someone else. So there is no read to be gained on anyone's vote for Cactus, except probably me because I was one of the only ones to push it before that became a factor, so I don't recommend anyone use it as an excuse to townread anybody later in the game. Hopefully that makes sense. I am very tired.

If Dodd turns out to be scum, that's gonna set off some scum-alarms in me toward Slam. If I get sniped during the night phase, I would find that very incriminating towards him and possibly a few others so if that happens, please don't waste the chance it'll provide you guys to scumread some of the people here.

Point being, I interpreted Slam's words as a half-baked attempt to get sus off of Cactus which would make sense if Cactus is scum.

Him changing course to vote cactus does not affect my read of him because if they were scumbuddies and Slam knows Dodd isn't coming back or being replaced, it isn't towny of him to take him out of play like we all have chosen to do, it's just an action I'm skeptical about looking into.

I know I am doing it again lol sorry I'm done for now.

Vote count below, 8 required to lynch.

Cactus: 7 (Emprexx Plush, Jace, Ricky, Slam, Fenris, dmboogie, MethodicalSlacker)
dmboogie: 1 (MW)

Here is a handy timer

Right but if Dodd was scum and I was scum then I have less reason to be chill with whoever replaces Dodd being killed because they'd still be scum and hence my comrade. I'm assuming Dea isn't going to be shuffling around roles in light of Dodd being replaced.

Slam wrote: ↑Sat Apr 11, 2020 11:44 pm Right but if Dodd was scum and I was scum then I have less reason to be chill with whoever replaces Dodd being killed because they'd still be scum and hence my comrade. I'm assuming Dea isn't going to be shuffling around roles in light of Dodd being replaced.

That's fair, but to also be fair whoever would've replaced Dodd would have been dealt a bad hand to start, so if hypothetically you were scum, I don't see how distancing yourself from the replacement wouldn't still be the only logical way to go to keep suspicion off of you.

Also, I'm a bit confused about the Dodd situation. What I'm seeing is that we're just gonna keep him in play so we can lunch him, so that Deamon doesn't have to replace him or shuffle roles or do anything complicated. Is that correct?

Can someone take a vote off? L-1 is a little close for my taste when there's still almost two whole days left.

Sidenote: anyone who hammers with this much time left in the bank gets an automatic scumread from me.

My conditional townread of slam is much stronger than my conditional scumread of slam, but the logic there is basically:

Derailing a lynch on a Cactus scumbuddy is a lost cause, in my view. It's a train with a lot of momentum on it, Cactus might get modkilled even if Slam somehow stops the lynch, and if Cactus flips scum, well, that's automatically going to draw a lot of attention to Slam for defending him. Sure, he can argue his way out of it, but generally speaking the center of attention is a bad place to be for scum unless you're a very loud, influential voice, and you feel confident in your ability to get the rest of town to follow your lead-- and this game has a rather high percentage of active players, so even that's no guarantee. The cost-benefit analysis just doesn't line up, especially given how wishy-washy the defense is. Also, if scum!Slam wanted to defend Cactus and play the 'I was a misguided townie who genuinely thought he was town' card, a hard defense would make a lot more sense.

Conversely, if Cactus is town, pushing weakly against his case makes perfect sense from a scum perspective. The train on him is strong, his lynch looks inevitable--by pushing against him weakly, you allow the lynch to go through, and then the next day you get to go on record as having pushed against the lynch of a townie. This isn't a 100% scumtell, since townies can do this as well, if they, say, think someone's town but would prefer not to no-lynch, but it tends scummy. To be fair, if I had been scum employing this tactic, I probably would've gone about it in a different way than Slam has, so he gets some townpoints back on that account--but not enough to move above scumnull, assuming cactus flips town.

Seconding the move to step back away from L-1. I support the Dodd lynch, but yeah, I still don't think a hammer is smart just yet. Plus I feel the last page has been useful re Slam and Jace discussions.

UNVOTE

sure whatever

sorry for being relatively quiet (like compared to last game lmao), i am lacking spoons atm but should be more active tomorrow (ic tomorrow not ooc tomorrow)

Fair. I'm mostly just anxious to see if I was right about Dodd (or rather Dodd's role) or not, but I am down to wait if we all wanna keep talking. I have more suspicions now than I did last night about people besides him, so it for sure isn't pointless to wait.

Also: I don't see Jace and Dodd as scumbuddies, given both of them pushed against each other. Initiating a fight with your scumbuddy, which is what Dodd would be doing in this case, without the chance to coordinate such a fight (since scum don't get their chat until night 1), just feels very risky. Especially since Jace is new.

Mind, if Dodd is town, Jace shoots to the top of my scumlist. Way, way, way too anxious about how a Dodd townflip would look on you, my dude.

Okay catching up and stuff which means I'm like halfway into the thread (woo hoo ><).

I'll put together more meaningful thoughts as I go but I'm gonna start with the obligatory grumble that I hate FOS. Hate it! I don't think it's scummy or anything but I think it discourages reading and it communicates absolutely nothing not better said in an actual sentence with more words. People like to use it as an oomph beat but frankly in a game where you can change your vote might as well make the oomph beat a vote and put your money where your mouth is.

/screed

Zetsu wrote: ↑Sun Apr 12, 2020 2:40 am Mind, if Dodd is town, Jace shoots to the top of my scumlist. Way, way, way too anxious about how a Dodd townflip would look on you, my dude.

I didn't say I cared how it made me look, I just said I care about if I was right or not. I already know I'm gonna get lynched eventually. I'm not even trying to fight that anymore lol.

Also, I did already say when I voted for Dodd that I accept the lynch I'm gonna get if I'm wrong. That still stands. If me getting killed affected the game in any way, I wouldn't have put my 'life' on the line by essentially making myself the kill-dodd posterboy, even before he quit the game. I've openly admitted there's no escaping being top scum-pick if Dodd turns out to be town. So do with that what you will.

Sure! But it's not so much what you're saying about it that's setting my alarms off as the fact that you're talking about it at all. The degree to which you're fixated on the possibility and what it means for you feels off. Townies usually aren't quite that preoccupied with where they're standing in the game, or with how they'll be read.